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Why did you take the overlay away and make it a $250 option? The ultimate bait and switch.

If this is not changed I am going to look at all my GPS option again. Previous to this i was a fan. I paid money for all my MBtiles files to use on your app. Now maybe a lowrance makes more sense. At least its a one time fee then. i understand its a business and may have needed to be done, its just that as the consumer this definitely leaves a bad taste in my mouth.


  • Damian_offthegridDamian_offthegrid Posts: 652Administrator, Moderator admin
    As we currently build up the platform and work alongside our larger backend mapping partners, the overlay feature had to be moved to the Pro Pack subscription. This capability is a MBTile feature designed by these specific partners and was intended for data overlay use and for massive offline mapping through larger contracts. It was never intended for mass base mapping through outside providers. We also used it for simple overlays of events through contracts with the event organizers.

    These major outside providers are currently increasing pricing by a significant amount this November for these capabilities. With a lot of app manufacturers currently taking advantage of mass users with this lower pricing. You will see all of these more mainstream and general use GPS applications over the next few months dropping these higher end offline mapping options, as they cannot afford to keep it for a lower $20 a year subscription rate. In fact, some have announced and dropped this capability already. Otherwise these were great options, for general use, and I would have suggested them as a possibility.

    LEADNAV will continue to focus on professional use while offering the best capabilities available for our specific users. The majority of the subscription covers the costs of all these outside services and as we promote, if you are online in a cellular environment then the core $20 LEADNAV application is a great option. However if you are offline then you will need a subscription. On foot you can get away with Advanced pack for smaller areas and in a mobility platform you will want Pro pack for its larger ability to store and host offline map imagery and this MBTile feature owned by these outside providers.

    I know this all doesn’t help you any and we appreciate you running the core $20 LEADNAV GPS application.

    Over the past few months we have been working on pulling App subscriptions sales from the Apple store and into our own hands. This way we have more control over the sale of our app. (I personally pay $250 a year for Pro pack, and I own the app…) our control over this was officially launched last week. So now you can take advantage of the 15% discount for pro on our online store.

    If not, again I do appreciate you running our core application and sorry for the changes.
  • EvelKnievelEvelKnievel Posts: 4Member
    edited November 8
    This is more than a bait and switch. We paid for app functionality for a lifetime. They took away the functionality that we already paid for and now want $250 a year for it. It's definitely unethical and most likely illegal. I'm certain that Apple should hear about it.

    The absurd aspect is that mbtiles functionality isn't dependent on a costly service like online map sources. There isn't an ongoing expense to justify an ongoing subscription cost. Especially one that's so exorbitant. The cost went from one time $20 to $250 a year. That's a significant jump.

    Your iTunes listing states "Free Map Sources include Bing, OpenCycleMap, OpenStreetMap and support of offline mapping options like MBTiles".
    Post edited by EvelKnievel on
  • Damian_offthegridDamian_offthegrid Posts: 652Administrator, Moderator admin
    edited November 8
    The MBTile file type is a capability provided and intended for our outside map providers and is used for contracted services. These are the map providers we pay for their services and features within our application. They are in the process of greatly raising prices this month to the point all of your more mainstream cheaper $20 a year applications out there are dropping these higher grade providers.

    We are not, and working alongside these providers to provide the highest level of capabilities we can to our professional clients at the price point we need to to continue their services.

    Currently we are turning on better map and feature usage monitoring to better price and appease these map providers. So prices will continue to vary as we continue to evolve and develop our capabilities.

    Again MBTile was intended for contracted mapping and services and it falls under the Pro level of user. We have no affiliation with outside products or companies that are using this format, owned by our map providers, to sell on their own.

    Understand your frustration but at $20 for a lifetime gps you are not paying for offline mapping or contracted overlays.

    There are many features in the pro level that we continue to evolve, maintain and update. These subscriptions pay for the development. You will most likely see the core app eventually given out for free with subscriptions.

    Post edited by Damian_offthegrid on
  • EvelKnievelEvelKnievel Posts: 4Member
    The mbtiles functionality that I'm referring isn't related to online map service providers or contract services. I'm referring to the ability to load an offline ".mbtiles" map using iTunes file sharing.
  • Damian_offthegridDamian_offthegrid Posts: 652Administrator, Moderator admin
    edited November 8
    Our MBTile functionality was intended for our contracted mapping services and overlays through us and our providers. Where are you getting your mbtiles from? Are you building them or paying for them through an outside provider/company?

    We did look at the app description from this recent update and you are correct that the verbiage did not get updated and we apologize. The team is working on getting that description updated now so thank you for pointing that out.

    If you did purchase the LEADNAV app since this update based off that description we fully support you contacting Apple for a refund if you are not happy with the $20 capability nor looking to run Pro for the MBTile functionality.

    Once our map and feature usage integration gets put in you will see a different pricing structure with pro being more affordable for its features with separate billing for the amount of map imagery utilized or needed per user. At this point you may see MBTile support come down into and Advanced subscription level.
  • EvelKnievelEvelKnievel Posts: 4Member
    edited November 8
    They're maps that I purchased.

    Saying that you intended the functionality for something else is nonsense. You advertised and sold the app with functionality that allowed users to load their own maps. Your iTunes store listing still even states that it's a free map source. I'm trying to use it exactly as intended and advertised. Your iTunes store listing is proof of that.

    Now, you've removed that functionality and you want users to pay $250 a year for something they already purchased.

    You don't get to sell something then take away to make them buy it again. That's not how legitimate businesses work.

    Obviously the original poster, myself and others need this feature. You sold it to us. We're entitled to it. That's how business works.

    Why would you not continue supporting mbtiles maps loaded using iTunes file sharing? They have nothing to do with the online maps that have a cost associated with them.
  • Damian_offthegridDamian_offthegrid Posts: 652Administrator, Moderator admin
    edited November 8
    We are sorry you are no longer happy with your $20 purchase of LEADNAV. With software, feature sets often change as things evolve and develop. With iOS13 for example, Apple pulled GPX and MBTILE from everyone as a standard file type just a few weeks ago after utilizing it for 6 years. This was once accepted and controlled by them as well.

    We spend a lot of ongoing development time on maintaining and improving the LEADNAV gps application and the MBTile functionality is part of that as it advances.

    Again apologize and you or anyone else trying to utilize LEADNAV for outside MBTiles with the core application may absolutely request a refund on your $20 purchase or we can upgrade you to Pro pack for your troubles.
    Post edited by Damian_offthegrid on
  • EvelKnievelEvelKnievel Posts: 4Member
    Feature sets usually change as a result of adding functionality. If a feature is removed, it's because it's obsolete and no longer needed. You're not removing the feature. You're trying to introduce an ongoing fee for something we already purchased. If you decide to change your licensing model, then you're required to grandfather in everybody that purchased under the previous licensing model. You don't get to charge twice. That's unethical and probably illegal. You sold us a product. We own the right to use it.

    I don't want a refund and I don't want to pay $250 a year for something I already purchased. I purchased mbtiles functionality from you and I'm entitled to it. That's how the business transaction works. It's a commitment.

    Myself, the original poster, alexr and thousands of other customers(alex has 400 alone) all purchased your app to use mbtiles functionality and we're entitled to it.

    How does Apple have anything to do with a $250 yearly cost just to use mbtiles or gpx?

    As a customer, it doesn't make since for you to charge an exorbitant $250/year for feature that isn't a service. We're not using online maps. There isn't an ongoing expense to justify it. We don't even need app updates. We just need the original app that we paid for.

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